Dane Fields is an English teacher at South Granville High School in Creedmoor, North Carolina. While she does not have a lot of experience with abstract art, she likes to incorporate art as much as possible into her curriculum so students have varying ways of engaging with the material. Also, living in a small town, she speaks about why her neighbors are less likely to visit museums and how that could be changed.
Q: My first question is, as a high school English teacher, how do you incorporate art into your lesson plans?
A: Well, I tend to do art when I'm doing novel based lessons. Oftentimes I'll either, for instance, I taught The Crucible, and what I did was I showed students the number of the Salem Witch Trials based art pieces that are out there, and we kind of just went over those. I looked at it from a historical place. I looked at it from an artistic place. I looked at it from a visual media place, because I also played the film. So, you know, I just kind of encompassed it into the conversation, to kind of give students a well rounded, at least, idea of what was happening at the time, and to let them see the different perspectives that people have taken throughout the years. Another way I incorporate art is in their assessments. For example, when I teach the Great Gatsby, we talk about the book cover.
What is the book cover? It's done by, you know, I can't think of his name right now, but it's done by what was at the time, a great artist, right? And so we talk about that. But then what I do is an assessment. I allow the students to do that type of thing as well, like I give them a rubric of course, the conversation needs to be what would make me pick up your book, right? And so I have them do a book cover, and I have them incorporate - we talk about theme, we talk about motif, we talk about the different symbolism pieces that are done throughout the story, and we make a list of all of those. Some of [the students] really love doing it. They find that it's incredibly enriching, and some of the stuff that they develop and create is just really masterful. It's amazing, so it's really fun to see how they take that and do something with it. Then, of course, they have to interpret it by telling me what it's about. So we do that, right? And so it's really getting them to think, you know, of art in graphic design, like how it's used to make people curious, to engage the population. I do that a lot. So far, I've done that with [The Great] Gatsby, and now I'm doing kind of a one pager where I expect them to use words and images to create a one pager. So that's how we incorporate art, too. It allows them to interpret the material themselves.
Q: I also, I feel like the Gatsby cover is kind of abstract in its own way, we have the eyes and the lips and, but you can’t really distinguish which city.
A: And then when you find out that those are Zelda's eyes. I've seen an image of Zelda, and then the interpretation of, you know, the eyes on the cover over her, and it's, it is mind boggling. You don't realize that he used Zelda eyes, because her eyes are somewhat wider across, and so, you know for him to have used her is just brilliant. But yes, it's just getting kids to look at the the covers. We;re getting ready to start Fahrenheit 451. It’s about book burning, right? And so getting the kids to look at the cover and see that it's a matchbox with matches in it, but it's in the shape of a book, right? So, it's just really cool how it's been designed, but it's also getting them to look at it and actually see it.
Q: I do have a follow up question, is the one pager for Gatsby, or is it for another one of your books?
A: So the book cover is for [The Great] Gatsby, and then the one pager is for The Crucible. And I haven't really decided if, or, you know, if I'm going to do an artistic piece for Fahrenheit [451]. I'm not really sure.
Q: Do you have any other strategies to help students engage with art, like close looking?
A: No, I don't. I know I probably should, but I actually do not do that much. I have a really hard group this year. They're just not interested, like, if they're interested in art, then they're in the art class, and if they're not interested in art, and then they just don't, they don't engage with it, they don't care about it, and it just kind of breaks my heart, but if it's not on their phone, they don't care about any of it, to be honest with you, and that's a real challenge that we're finding right now is getting kids to engage in things that aren't on their Instagram pages. I do try to bring up, when we're doing Gatsby, you know, we talk about the Roaring 20s. We talk about the art deco, artistic style of the time, we talk about how it was to live during that time, but as to like, actually pull like artistic pieces from that time period, unless it's relevant to the story. I don't use it.
Q: What do you think is the importance of the intersection between writing and art? How do they help one another?
A: I think that a lot of times people learn with so many different aspects, you have visual learners, you have auditory learners, there are so many different types of learning, and I think that engaging all of those in the course of writing is very important, because what you do is you allow students to connect the dots, right? Some kids don't connect the dots when they're reading. They get confused, you know, because sometimes it's flowery language, let's be honest. You know, I love Fitzgerald. I think he's wonderful, but, I mean, he's like, way up here for these kids, right? And the story they get, but his language is just very flowery and different and poetic, and that's very hard for them. So when you engage them on a level of understanding that includes artistic pieces via whatever, be it artistic art or be it media, anything like that, what you're doing is you're helping to solidify the story. You're solidifying the themes, right? Because I go really heavy on theme when we're doing Gatsby. So, you know, it's just trying to get them to understand and connecting to real world situations, and helping them to understand all of it together.
Q: I know we've talked about how you'll give students the novels [you read] in graphic novel form.
A: Yes, I have done that for sure. It makes it easier on kids that don't do as well with the reading. I also use, of course, the film as media to engage the students because otherwise, they just could not get it. There's a lot that I use to kind of help these students understand the material. But yes, I have used graphic novels. I keep some graphic novels in my classroom to help students if they want to do some reading. I have a book club where they just come in and they're allowed to read, they can get anything off the shelf that they want. And I have a number of graphic novels that they can engage directly with, and they don't need my help with that.
Q: What resources do you use when you pick your art pieces?Do you go to a certain website, or a certain archive that you use? Or are you pulling from lots of places?
A: I'm pulling from different sources. A lot of times I'll pull from the internet. I don't even know where I got the book cover idea. A lot of times, and you'll find that with teachers, they are scavengers. They scavenge ideas from different sources, and so you'll think, “Oh, I kind of like that idea,” but, but maybe it's not the actual novel that you're working with, and so I will accommodate it to what I'm doing, and that's what I use, I think that art is such an important part of students’ understanding that the reason why I make it an assessment is because some students, they don't test well, but they are creative minded kids, right? They are in art class, they engage in art all day. You can tell that they are the type of student that you know just loves to do different things artistically, and so that's the intent, right, of allowing them to to engage in the art piece [because] there has to be something for them too, right, not just those kids that you know can whip through a test. So art plays a big role, not just in engaging, but it also plays a huge role in connecting to kids who see the world differently. That's really important.
Q: What is the value of museums for your students? Do you think students are even going to museums nowadays?
A: I don't. I think it's very unfortunate. I think that a lot of students don't go to museums. I wish they did. I think that in a lot of ways, you have to engage the parents. A lot of parents, especially in a rural area, many of them don't go to museums themselves. I won't say all, because there are, you know, those outliers. I mean, like, I'm an outlier. I live in a rural area, and I'll go to a museum in a heartbeat. You know, I love museums. They're like, one of my favorite things to do, but a lot of them, they're very hard working people. A lot of them are blue collar, and so maybe they don't feel comfortable in a museum, or don't really think about a museum as something they would like to engage in. You know, their time is their own, and a lot of times they might maybe go see a concert or whatever. Students get a lot of art at the school, we have a wonderful art teacher, and she does a fabulous job of engaging and throwing up art on all of the walls and the halls and everything, and some of the students' art is just really, really beautiful. But as an idea for students to pick up and go to the art museum? Many don't. They never talk about it.
I wish there was more engagement with museums. I really do. I don't think that they've gone to a museum in a long time. They may go at the younger level. They may go at the middle school level. What I have found is that there is so much red tape for field trips now that teachers have stopped going unless it's something they have to do, like, mandatory. [For example], say the Agriculture department has to go to the fairgrounds, because they have children that are showing cows and sheep and stuff like that, so they have to go, right? But things that they don't have to do, I think that a lot of teachers are opting out. They're like, “No, I'm not going through all that,” because you've got to get all these disclaimers and all these releases, and then you've got to get all the medical information, you've got to get it approved by the county. I mean it’s an egregiously long process, and I think that most teachers are now like, “Yeah, I'm not doing that.” Because I remember, years ago, I took my kids to a play, and I wouldn't even consider that right now, because of just how difficult they've made it for you to be able to take your kids to an enrichment program. My kids will say, “can we go do something?” and I'm like, “I wish.”
Q: Why did they make that change?
A: I don't know. I don't know if it was at the state level. I don't know. I just know that they added a whole layer of lawyer speak onto all of the extra, you've got to get it approved before it's even considered, then you've got to go through all of the paperwork and it's this really long process. You can't just say, “Hey, I'd like to take my kids to this thing. You know, this is what they'll be doing, blah, blah, blah.” It’s almost like there's a committee that’s gotta approve it. It's just crazy, and a lot of teachers are opting out. They're not going anywhere, they're not going to play, they're not going to museums. It's another thing that is in the way of taking kids somewhere and letting them engage material.
A: A lot of these kids, you know, many of their parents, like I said, many of their parents, they're hard working people, but they don't have that kind of time, and if they go [to the museum], they don't know what they're doing there anyway. They're not comfortable there, they don't know how to engage in it, and it's perfectly understandable, you know, they're just working class people and it's just not high on their list, right? High on their list might be doing something that is relevant to what they've done, or doing something relevant to their families, you know, like going places with their families, but it's not at the top of their idea system. You know, they're not going, “Okay, let's go over to the museum today.” You know, a lot of them don't do that. It's perfectly understandable.
Q: Do you think there would be a way that museums could help get them in the door?
A: Without a doubt. I think if there were an engagement- I know that they do a lot, [for example] our art museum. I mean, you got kids that'll go to the National History Museum downtown Raleigh all the time, right? Because they can see animals and such and, oh, they love that stuff, but, but art is a little bit more- there's a veil between art and understanding it. All you see in front of you is a painting, and I understand that, but I think that it if they were to, and I don't know if they've ever considered it, but if they did, I think that an outreach that maybe engaged, you know, art teachers, you know, “Hi, you know, we want to run you through this particular piece that we have. We're going to have it until this time, and we would love for your kids to come and see it.” I don't even know if they encourage that. That's the truth. Some of the pieces in the museum are priceless. You know, they've got that painting called Emily, that was done by a Jewish artist, and it was one of the paintings that was supposed to be destroyed during the Nazi regime, and somehow it didn't get destroyed. I don't remember the story behind it, but that painting is priceless, you know, and there's a number of other pieces in there that are really, really important to our history and to our understanding of the world. And I don't know if they even want kids in there, right? I don't know how they feel about that. Now, used to be that you could be pretty sure that kids that went to the museum knew how to behave. I don't know if they feel that way anymore. I don't know if that's a thing. I know that that sounds really finger pointing, but a lot of kids, they don't know how to act. They don't know how to behave at a place. And so, you know, you go in there, and the whole time the teacher is holding her breath, hoping that you're not the kid just gonna stick their finger through one of the paintings. I don't really know if that's a thing anymore.
Q: Also getting back to what you said earlier about people, kids, looking at a painting, it's usually something, flat on the wall, and I think there's an extra layer of that, if it is abstract art, because it's not a recognizable image. And so you can't understand those themes as well. And so then you're like, “I see colors on a piece, but what does that mean for me?”
A: There are some abstract paintings at, you know, the museum [North Carolina Museum of Art], really beautiful paintings, but I mean, I'm an adult, and I've taken art classes, and I've taken art history, and art appreciation, and I still don't see the reasoning behind why they're on the wall. You know, they're just color, blocks of color. Oh, that's cute, but I could have done that. Do you know what I mean? But I understand that they are a part of an artistic movement, right? But it's being an adult, knowing that, right? You don't have to like the painting. You just have to understand that it plays a role, right? But kids don't, they just look at that and go, “What's that?” “Why is that up there?”
Q: What is your connection to abstract art? How does it make you feel?
A: I don't get into a lot of abstract art. I'm just not much for it. I love the Impressionists, and I think that, in a lot of ways, if you think about it, that can be abstract because it's taking and boiling down movement and and and images to the color behind it. And so, you know, if you're looking at it up close, it's just a jumble of colors. You have to look at it from far back to actually see the image. So in some ways, you know it kind of takes that abstractness to it. I've grown in appreciation for Picasso over time, especially his paintings like Guernica. I've grown an appreciation for it because art is just there for art's sake, right? It's an interpretation of life, and I really like it, but I've not been able to get that much into abstract and I think it's just because it's not been explained to me. I think in order for you to get into abstract part, you need to have a professor or a teacher that really understands it and understands why it is, why it is. And I think that there may be some that feel very intimidated by it and don't approach how to teach it. And of course, then, you're not learning it.
Q: What would help you understand abstract art better?
A: I'm probably along the lines of those blue collar people, you know, not all of them, once again, I'm not talking in, you know, black and white terms here, but those that don't want to engage in art because they don't understand it and don't really see a reasoning for it, other than it's pretty on a wall. And it's nothing, not cutting them down, because I get it. I understand how it just is not relevant sometimes to what they're doing, so I get it, and I guess I'm probably along those same lines with abstract art. It's not relevant to me right now. And I love art, don't get me wrong. But if I go into a museum corridor or something, and they've got abstract in one area and they've got impressionism in another, guess which one gets my attention. Impressionism gets my attention. If I can get a look at a Picasso, or I can look at a a Van Gogh, or I can look at a Gustav Klimt, if I can look at any of those artists that I've grown to be very fond of over an abstract piece, I'm going to go for them because the abstract is something that is unfamiliar to me, is not relevant to me. I look at it and I don't understand it. I don't see what they want me to see.
A: I think that a lot of teachers might be like because this one is easier for kids to get, and James Brooks isn't as easy for kids to get, I'm going to show them the Blue Period of Picasso, or I'm going to show them Van Gogh, something that connects to the kid in some way. There's relevant images in the painting that grasp, whereas, with James Brooks, what is there to get? They don't. They can't. They can't move beyond that veil to understand that painting.
Q: My last question for you is, how does art affect social justice from what you've seen?
Without art, there is no awareness to social justice. There have been those that have been so courageous and have been willing to put on canvas, or whatever medium they've used, paper, images that make you go, “wow,” right? And then you try to understand it, because you want to know why that image exists, and it engages you, and it helps you to understand the importance of recognizing equality, recognizing, you know, safe spaces for people recognizing your part, right? So there's a lot of different kind of layers of understanding how art plays a role in everything we do. It's just extremely important to understanding the world we live in. And I think that the social justice pieces [are] vital to understanding not only who we are as human beings, but also helping us to understand and be sympathetic to others and understanding their place. I think it plays a huge role.
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